[Mafia] Codename: Mafia - Round 2

[PointMaid]

I agree it seems better than nothing, yes.

I'm also curious about what the 'confession' means.

I find no use in cutting things unnecessarily short. I have enough shortness in my life anyway.

[TenOfSwords13]

Day closes in 5 Days(ish)

Current votes:

- Knife 1 (Florien)

[NebulaChimera2211]

Florien: A revealed Bulletproof doesn't really help anymore... unless Knife's double-bluffing.
But if she's scum, you're right in that removing the possible Execution Immunity is a priority. That assumes she's bad when we have no evidence to suggest either alignment, except not immediately explaining how her "confession" works.

PointMaid: You said you knew a random goodie would give a false "evil" result. I'm not sure if you could've made that up, because usually false "evil" results tend to be part of the person being investigated, not the person doing the investigating. So I'll trust your claim for the time being.

Whistle: Now that I think about it, your claim's one that's conspicuously obvious. I don't think there's anything else against you, but I'll keep an eye out.

[Kennifer]

Yes, you'd think that learning alignment would be the only choice for Point's role. If she was Good anyway. If she was Evil, since afiak this is just Good vs. Evil without third party weirdness... she'd know her Evil teammates and thus know anyone *not* mentioned in such a DM was Good by default and thus wouldn't have use for that ability. She'd probably have some kind of corrupt cop role that messes with stuff instead, but would probably pretend she could see alignments as that'd be a strictly Good-aligned ability.

So, I figured it'd be good to make sure there was someone whose judgement could be trusted.

[Florien]

Well, yes, we have no evidence to suggest either Alignment for Knife, but that means we have a what, 30% chance? And execution immunity helps scum team members with it, and doesn't have any impact on town team members with it, so I see no reason not to take that out of play as quickly as possible, given we're working off basically nothing here.

[PointMaid]

I'm also keeping an eye on lurkers and those reluctant to divulge roles. Yes, it happens for Townies, and divulging powerful roles can lead to getting targeted, but it can also be a way for scum to avoid getting caught in contradictions.

Specifically, though, if someone does know that they're the townie who would read as scum to me, it's probably better for all involved to let it be known before I find out by checking your alignment. That's the tack I took as the Outsider in Witch Hunt, and it worked.

[Mr. Lee Hammer]

Besides Florien's reasoning, I did find it fishy why Knife just wants to skip and get it over with. I mean we have a lot of time to figure this out, to see how people are. And how Knife wants to end this real quickly makes me want to keep eyes on her. Granted she may not be used to this format of games. It's obviously nothing like how murdergames are so far, but still...

[Whistle]

We want this to go on, generally, but I'm unsure. I don't know how to do it, but Knife is really getting the FoS now...

[MadameButterflyKnife]

how do these things usually work, anyways? all i know is that in the first one the game ended immediately

[Whistle]

You played in one. Cast the deciding vote to get me eliminated.

It's basically Murdergames without the roleplaying or storytelling elements.

[Kennifer]

Thinking about what Florien said a bit.

Ideally we'd vote off a scum but Point wasn't lucky enough to check on someone evil last night so there's no concrete lead there.

So in the absence of that lead... say we do vote Knife. If Knife is good and the ability claim is true, the worst that happens is she loses her "extra life", we haven't killed an innocent. If she's evil... either the bulletproof claim is true and while we haven't killed a scum we've gotten rid of her backup life. If the ability claim isn't true, we're out a scum.

...now I'm not sure why she'd lie about that ability off the top of my head, but it does seem like a safer vote than some.

[PointMaid]

Yeah, like I said, I'll go for that if there isn't a better alternative.

[NebulaChimera2211]

how do these things usually work, anyways? all i know is that in the first one the game ended immediately

During the Day, you try to figure out who's evil (unless you are evil, in which case you have to convince us that you're good). In absence of other evidence, you can try to find out who's evil based on what they're saying.

The first one ended before anyone died because Florien had a role that turned out to be game-breakingly powerful; they instantly outed all of the scum.

Do you have any suspects atm?

Whistle: I can vouch; I was the host and she was scum that time. I've only seen her in one game, and I'm not sure if that's enough for her to really learn this game. She died around Day 2 iirc.

PointMaid: Do any of the lurkers seem suspicious to you right now?
The only players I'd suspect of being an Outsider if they're good are Smily and Florien; the former claimed that he wasn't and you claim the latter gives you a "good" result. Hence I don't think the random player you'd get a false "evil" result for knows they do.

Kennifer: I didn't think about stuff that could mess with investigative results, good point. The only thing I thought she could've been if she was scum was a Rolecop, and that could go either way. If the way I asked was a little rude, then I apologise.

The biggest issue that I have with voting Knife is that she could also be lying about being Bulletproof as an innocent, to deter attackers because she actually has a powerful role. Unless she actually acts sus (like Matthew did last round after claiming Miller), I'd like to move on for the time being and come back to her later.

Lavender: Does your role count people who vote for you at some point, but don't end the day voting for you, or does it only count the people on your wagon at the end of the day?

[PointMaid]

Looking again at who's being a lurker, MP/Despair's Archon of Memes hasn't said anything at all yet. ...To be honest though, I'm not sure that's entirely something all that likely to be a scum behavior, usually they say *something*. I think. Or be aware that the game is going on even more than an innocent would.

[Mr. Lee Hammer]

Although do keep in mind scum have used MP's lurking against us to fool us into thinking he's scum. Probably the king of getting misslimmed. So on that note, we should probably be cautious just in case someone tries to push us into thinking he's one of the bad ones

[Despair's Archon of Memes]

Late, but indeed. That does seem to be a theme with me.

I've mostly been busy with other stuff, including dealing with anxiety recently, so I haven't really found much time to post here... I apologize.

In addition, I don't really have much to say on the matter much, I feel.

[LavenderDream]

Nebula: It only works if they have me voted by the end of the day.

[NebulaChimera2211]

So I take it's the former? (people that vote you and later unvote also count)

Who has the least plausible claims? Is there anyone else who has a suspiciously obvious claim?
To me, DAoM's claim needs a leap in logic, but it's plausible enough.
CG and Matthew having variants of the same sort of role feels contrived.

Lavender, CG and Matthew's claims in are alignment checkers of some sort, so they could easily be faked, since the evil people know who's good.

[LavenderDream]

It's the latter.

[MadameButterflyKnife]

so theoretically, what if a few of us voted for Lavender (not enough to hammer them) so they'd be able to vouch for a few of us over the night

[TenOfSwords13]

Day closes in 4 Days(ish)

Current votes:

- Knife 1 (Florien)

[PointMaid]

...I guess the ability would be useless if it didn't work unless they were actually hammered. So that should work. But we'd need to be very clear about NOT going over the limit and actually hammering her.

That could in fact be combined with *actually* hammering somebody - iff we can get everybody on board with someone to do that to. But that might potentially be more risky. Unless it was, say, testing what you said about your ability, Knife.

[PointMaid]

It does depend on Lavender being an innocent, though, since otherwise she could say anything to get us to mislim. I should plan on alignment-checking her tonight.

[NebulaChimera2211]

...I guess the ability would be useless if it didn't work unless they were actually hammered. So that should work. But we'd need to be very clear about NOT going over the limit and actually hammering her.

That could in fact be combined with *actually* hammering somebody - iff we can get everybody on board with someone to do that to. But that might potentially be more risky. Unless it was, say, testing what you said about your ability, Knife.

It does depend on Lavender being an innocent, though, since otherwise she could say anything to get us to mislim. I should plan on alignment-checking her tonight.

This confuses me.

I assumed they meant that they privately learn how many scum voted them. Say only scum vote for them. There's not enough (right now) to (even nearly) hammer, but they learn who's bad. However, that might make them a target for scum kill, so someone should protect them.
I have no idea where that second paragraph came from. Can you explain?
I'll agree that they're a good choice to check the alignment of.

[PointMaid]

...I guess the ability would be useless if it didn't work unless they were actually hammered. So that should work. But we'd need to be very clear about NOT going over the limit and actually hammering her.

That could in fact be combined with *actually* hammering somebody - iff we can get everybody on board with someone to do that to. But that might potentially be more risky. Unless it was, say, testing what you said about your ability, Knife.

It does depend on Lavender being an innocent, though, since otherwise she could say anything to get us to mislim. I should plan on alignment-checking her tonight.

This confuses me.

I assumed they meant that they privately learn how many scum voted them. Say only scum vote for them. There's not enough (right now) to (even nearly) hammer, but they learn who's bad. However, that might make them a target for scum kill, so someone should protect them.
I have no idea where that second paragraph came from. Can you explain?
I'll agree that they're a good choice to check the alignment of.

Sentence beginning with 'I assumed' - Sure. I just meant that if that's what we're doing we need to be very clear to EVERYBODY how many people would be mock-voting for Lavender and preferably who, so we didn't either accidentally hammer her or have someone 'accidentally' take advantage of the situation to mislim her while people were voting for her but not for real.

The second paragraph: I meant that the people not voting for Lavender could vote for Knife for real to test the die-protection she claimed. But it would likely take all the rest of us to do that, and getting everyone on board with it might be difficult.